Recco

AllyG You are quoting Analogue and Digital Transceiver Range statistics vs Recco passive receiver. IMHO there is no user capability for search or rescue with a Recco Receiver. Period. Your survival, and the survival of your friends and family will rely solely on an employee of the resort/helicopter/ another paid professional.

As a purchaser of a Recco receiver you'll just have to trust that someone sees you and arrives who is suitably equipped, before your air time runs out. If not maybe you'll be lucky and be able to dig yourselves out like the British guy in the link I posted. In case you didn't follow the link, he was on an open piste.

Many Transceivers have a harness and fastening the harness switches on the unit.

I found the Recco detector range on the Recco.com website. This is what it says:




RECCO® detectors are used by organized rescue teams to locate individuals equipped with RECCO reflectors. RECCO's newest R9 detector can also located standard 457kHz avalanche beacons too. The RECCO detector is not intended for companion-rescue, but in the hands of trained searchers it enables efficient location of an avalanche burial when the victim is wearing a reflector. The detectors, which are positioned at convenient locations on the mountain, are operated by area ski patrols, helicopter skiing companies and search-and-rescue outfits.

The current detector has evolved significantly and now weighs only 950 grams (2.1 pounds). At this light weight, it is extremely portable and can be easily operated in rough terrain or harsh conditions. Its simple-to-use components include an on-off switch, power regulator, battery and socket charger. The self-contained unit can be used at full power for about two hours of search time before it needs to be recharged.

The range of the detector is a complex calculation of many variables including moisture content of snow, direction of burial and orientation of the RECCO detector to the buried reflector. The maximum range of the system is 200 meters through air and 20 meters through snow. A 20-meter corridor, 10 on each side, is recommended for the mountain search path, and an angled orientation of the detector to the slope is optimal for the first phase of the search.

I suppose this explains how the Recco detectors can work from a helicopter.

Bandit,
Do you think on-piste and at the side of the piste skiers like me, really need to buy an avalanche transceiver then? Surely, if I thought the risk of being caught by an avalanche in these circumstances was high enough to need a transceiver, I'd also need an avalung (for oxygen) and an exploding ABS pack (something like the safety air bags in the car I suppose) to keep me on top of the snow, and if I was planning on helping to find others I'd also need the shovel and probes/poles.

Do even the ski instructors ski around on piste with all this lot?

All this talk of avalanches has scared me right off going past the piste markers. In fact, maybe I will just stay at home next year :wink:

Ally

Ally, only you can decide how much risk is acceptable, and what steps you want to take to improve your odds, as your skills and skiing aspirations develop.

As you only go off piste with an instructor, have a look at these photos of a group in the care of a Val Thorens instructor working for Club Med AFAIK.

http://pistehors.com/news/forums/viewthread/429/

The photos were by J2skier Lesmen27.

In Switzerland there are a number of incidents each year where Avalanches cross the ski piste. Bandit do you know which one is mentioned earlier in this thread? I looked at the link but it seems the name of the resort has been removed which I find quite irresponsible.

Generally speaking if you are literally riding on the other side of the poles there is very little risk, but this isn't always that case. There were incidents in Zermatt and Davos that come to my head immediately where skirts set off avalanches very close to the edge of the piste.

For someone like Ally I would say if you want to ride beside the piste stick to flatter slopes and an Avalanche risk of less then 2. Once the avalanche risk goes up to 3 then you really need to have a little bit of a background in measuring the slope steepness and understanding the avalanche bulletin even if doing steeper unprepared runs in a ski area. As soon as you think about going any little bit past the poles and want to do some of the steeper offpiste terrain (30deg+) then it is time to get a transceiver shovel and probe AND LEARN HOW TO USE THEM!

As for the ranges of transceivers. The vast majority of 3 antenna digital models these days have a range of about 60m with no reduction due to orientation from the buried transceiver. The older Analogue models may have a higher range in perfect circumstances, but they would have a smaller range if not lined up correctly with the buried transceiver AFAIK.

Ir12daveor, I do believe that I can offer a link to the original article in 24Heures...

http://www.24heures.ch/actu/suisse/montagne-fait-mort-supplementaire-2010-02-27

Seems to be Champex-Lac, Valais.

Google Translate version


The appeal of the untouched snow seems to have played any role in a third avalanche occurred Saturday afternoon in Champex-Lac. Pluis precisely in the area of Breya, at about 2350 m altitude. The mudflow reached on any of the tracks from the small ski area, taking five skiers.

Fortunately, these three Englishmen and two Swiss were able to emerge only when, with the help of other customers. The avalanche dogs rushed to the scene did not intervene. The three Britons, slightly wounded, were taken to hospital. "But everyone was down on the chairlift. It was not so serious," said Jean-Pascal Tornay, director of lifts Champex. He said the snow did not exceed a 50 m thick.

Explaining that an avalanche could have ended up on an area marked? An investigating judge was on hand yesterday to investigate. Police Wallis speaks at this time of "undetermined causes". Jean-Pascal Tornay, he says that the casting has not been triggered by skiers.

"We secured all the corridors with dynamite, as it should, he says. Including the place where the avalanche finally left. It's bad luck." The man said he relieved the successful outcome of the accident, "very unusual" in the ski he heads.

So, the area had been secured by the piste management, who cite others in helping free those trapped, which is different to the report on SH, where no-one gave assistance.

Yes, we all need to practice more. Perhaps if J2skiers make it to Zermatt, there will be enough of us to organise a practice day? Perhaps Offpisteskiing could offer a package for us?

ir12daveor wrote:In Switzerland there are a number of incidents each year where Avalanches cross the ski piste. Bandit do you know which one is mentioned earlier in this thread?

Looks like it refers to the incident in Champex described here :- http://www.tdg.ch/actu/suisse/morts-avalanches-2010-02-28

[bandit beat me to it]

Admin wrote:

It's worth repeating the oft-observed (but critical) difference between American and European resorts with regard to off-piste skiing here. Off-piste in Europe is anywhere beyond the edges of the marked runs - immediately beyond those lines there is no guarantee a slope is safe. Folk are killed within resorts every winter.

That's a big difference. In the US you are paying for the Ski Patrol to make the designated inbounds area safe, or close areas which are not safe. Avalanches are extremely rare, so the cost/benefit of recco makes good sense for resort only users.
Having said that, if the avalanche risk is very high, I would probably err on the side of caution, even inbounds.

Trencher wrote:Having said that, if the avalanche risk is very high, I would probably err on the side of caution, even inbounds.

Wise words.